Is EM5 dead already

[William Stapleford]

Just wondering as I have checked the forum multiple times and have noticed that pretty much noone has posted anything anymore.

I see more post on EM4 forums then this one. Just wanted to see if everyone has given up on EM5 and switched backed to the modded EM4.

I see that very few mods have been made for EM5 and little to no information has been put out on making mods. I have been working on changing and adding lights to default models but that is about it.

Hopefully im wrong but doing a search online for EM5 shows very little activity. I think a total of 3 forums including steam abd all seem to be dead.

Thanks and hopefully we can make this game better since the company that produced it cared about nothing more than making a Profit.

Bill

[Handsup!]

Ehh...

 

It's a shame to say it, but, yeah, I think the community just doesn't want to go to EM5 because EM4 is more than good enough. 

[firemanphil]

I agree with Handsup. The modding community for EM4 already has so many great mods that it's really not necessary or wanted to switch to EM5. Modders for EM4 are already familiar with its scripting, models, map editing, and everything in-between. The graphics for EM4 are perfectly fine by my standards especially for the style in which the game is meant to be played. EM5 has made an emphasis on graphical upgrades, which they did, but there are still a lot of issues with the game that have yet to be fixed. There's really no need, unless you're truly a graphics junky, to switch to EM5 when there are many modders/mod teams out there that have a lot of experience with EM4. In my opinion if the marvelous EM4 modders/mod teams do switch over to EM5 we'll have to wait as long as we did to get all the mods for EM4 we have today, but for EM5. 

[rescue_nerd]

Ehh...

 

It's a shame to say it, but, yeah, I think the community just doesn't want to go to EM5 because EM4 is more than good enough. 

Agreed.

[Newfoundking]

The thing is, when E3 became E4 we moved over for a better engine and more advances with a similar editor, this game tried to redo everything, and people quite frankly are pissed off and don't wanna learn it all over again, with something difficult to adapt to. That and we ask for the same things for 10 years, and consistently they ignore the most basic asks. People I think are fed up with newer versions that do less. 

 

Emergency 5 built up to be the answer to our dreams and it was a bomb at best, so we ditched it as a community pretty much

[theparanoid]

The thing is, when E3 became E4 we moved over for a better engine and more advances with a similar editor, this game tried to redo everything, and people quite frankly are pissed off and don't wanna learn it all over again, with something difficult to adapt to. That and we ask for the same things for 10 years, and consistently they ignore the most basic asks. People I think are fed up with newer versions that do less. 

 

Emergency 5 built up to be the answer to our dreams and it was a bomb at best, so we ditched it as a community pretty much

Not to mention it ship with out modding abilities which where only add a month ago.    They basically release and unfinished untested game.  And have done little to nothing to fix it since then.  Then when user say the new edtior is to hard to use there answer is.  It more advance you can do more. 

 

It might be more powerfull but the learn curb is way to steep it not user friendly.   In mind the only worse release has been sim city 2013.   

[Chris07]

I think that language barrier in what documentation that has been provided by Sixteen Tons Entertainment is a huge contributor.

 

A full muti-part video was made on how to use the editor by the game creators but it's all in German. Unfortunately it has yet to be translated so we're pretty much stuck.

 

I'd like to move to EM5 modding but not knowing German makes the whole process much more difficult.

 

The modding mill in the German forums seems to be at full speed though. The primarily English community seems to be stalled out.

[William Stapleford]

I would have to agree with the language barrier problem. I have watched the videos and then copied the moves but honestly the vids only show a few things with the editor.  There is so so much more to play with in the editor that the tutorials don't even scratch.  I have been messing with the lighting on the vehicles and have learned a lot but nothing compared to others and nothing compared to the other guy that has the light mod out.  I wish they would give us more information on the actually creating new mesh objects and the actual controls and coding of the game.  Only then can this become a good a stable platform to work with. Its really sad to see something that had / has so much potential fail like this.  Hopefully some new people can step up to the plate and begin the process of messing with some of the coding.  I have once and managed to corrupt the games and prefabs so bad only a full re-install would fix it.

 

I would love to be able to implement traffic control lighting like EM4 had.  I have yet to find a way to add workable lights to a vehicle other then the ones coded into the game.  I think EM5 has a chance to survive but only us as a community have the chance of making that happen.

 

Its sad when a developer cares so much about the profit that they completely leave all the fans behind and release a game/sim that is incomplete at best and far from anything that the promised, then to charge full price for this is a joke.  It is becoming more and more common however with every game manufacturer / developer.

 

Does anyone know how to get modded prefabs into the game to test outside the editor.  Last time I attempted this it cost me all my work.

 

I can post some pics of some of the work if interested but i have no clue how to get it so others could try it.

 

Anyone know about creating meshes?

 

Bill

[MikeyPI]

The sad truth is that this game covers what would be termed a "niche" market, meaning that the overall potential interest in the whole wide world (not this community) is extremely limited.  This game in essence caters to a very select group of people interested in emergency services, but in no way can it be termed as a simulation, so that further decreases the number of potential players out there for it.  It even doesnt do that great of a job as an arcade-style game, since it is probably oversimplified to the point that most people would miss the challenge of a RTS, on top of not being a war-based RTS, yet another limiting factor for it.  That being said, because of it's limited consumer-base the number of people who have an interest and would have the time to delve into this new game when the older one is much much better documented with F.A.Qs/tutorials/videos to help you get started, and more core content available to start with in the older EM4 kind of lends to the fact of why most new entries will likely go to em4 over the simplified but prettier em5.

 

It sucks, but the reality is that with the limited help to get people into the new game, most people won't want to take the time to attempt to learn something completely new, especially if there flat out isnt much support out there to do so.  Why go into trailblazing when you can just re-use readily available content with documentation to help you integrate it how you want to make your mod?  From a practical standpoint it isnt hard to see why the new game is so limited in it's reach, nor why more people don't want to get into it.  The relatively small base for this game further limits the potential for there to be too many trailblazers out there who'll want to start anew with a brand new game, regardless of what potential there may be buried within the game code.. To me, I hear all this potential for what can be done, but find it quite sad that if that potential existed the original developer did not even use but a fraction of it themselves and expect the end-user to be the one to actually make the game complete..

 

And with that at a full retail price as high as it is, yeah... Not hard to fathom why this game has all but flopped for most people out there.  Typical Snatch and Grab of the cash with minor efforts to soothe the wounds for the people they got over on, but that's more to preserve the consumer base than to actually improve the situation in my eyes.  Too little too late for all those who spent the money for an incomplete game in the first place. Remember the game is from a developer widely known for lower-cost/lower budget titles, they are not considered to be one of the premiere labels out there for development, so the price point doesnt leave much room for the "ehh I'll give it a shot" crowd considering they can get a much much better-known and widely accepted title elsewhere at near if not the same price-point.

 

As to your development aspect of the questions I am sorry I cannot help as I have not/will not do em5 myself, hopefully someone else can help ya out with it somewhat anyway.

[Ropie58]

Should I be the manufactorer of this game and hearing/reading of all of these comments of its buyers, I wouldn't know where to look, let alone where to hide, out of pure shame - to be looked at as just being a money scraper... I would do anything in my power to proof all of them wrong. 

 

But then again, what do I know... 

[William Stapleford]

Very hard to hide from the truth, honestly if anything this should prove to 16ton ent. that the customers really do want a good quality product and that instead of shrugging us off maybe they should pay attention to the market. The whole the customer is always right attitude died a long long time ago it seems.

I would gladly pay for a full release of what we were promised, but this game is far from that and far from finished. Maybe they should contact the modders of EM4 and put them on the payed staff then we would get a quality sim and all the hard work they have done would be payed for an rewarded.

Hey just a quick question just tried on of the tutorials for reskinning the cow per the website and found that I can not create a project in the asset browser. I click on the button and it is "create to do" and then in the debug log it says it cant create the project. This means that I cant do much of anything.

Does anyone know what the most up to date version of the game is on Steam. I hate steam but it is the only way i can play as I cant get find EM5 on dvd anywhere in the states. Steam is another huge money grubbing company so who knows if they even updated the game. I'm afraid to update for fear of corrupting files and losing the prefabs i created with new lights and patterns.

Thanks

Bill

[WildcatsMike]

It's on life support. I wouldn't say it's dead completely, but there is some serious work needed to be done in order to keep it living.

 

Like NFK said, we ask for simple things that 16tons ET should be more than capable of doing, and in EM5 they focused more on graphics than gameplay.

 

Most games nowadays are starting to realize this, but gameplay > graphics always. They didn't add enough content to really say that it was completely different from the last game.

 

Take GTA V as an example. GTA V did so well because not only are the graphics amazing, but they added a TON of new things and features. As an example, if GTA IV = EM4, What 16tons ET did was create a new ENB. A good ENB at that, but people aren't gonna pay $60 for an ENB.

 

In EM5s defense, it did attempt to change the game up. However, it didn't add much, and what it did add was things that take away from the gameplay (Automation). While it is nice, it just means the player doesn't have to play the game nearly as much as in EM4.

 

EM5 will die. I think it's a little too early though. Mostly up to 16tons ET or the german magicians modders (German because they're the only ones who were explained to how to use the editor..) to give EM5 an advantage over EM4. So for now.. Life support. 

 

 

[Rivan]

I think that we all have to wait for the Germans to lead the way.. If they make a huge insane epic mod, maybe people such as Hoppah and others will get into EM5 modding too..

[itchboy]

I think that we all have to wait for the Germans to lead the way.. If they make a huge insane epic mod, maybe people such as Hoppah and others will get into EM5 modding too..

Hoppah and most of the pro modders have said it before that they are too busy these days to make something as big as the LA Mod was at the time. EM5 itself hasn't proven to be the most friendly or easy to use thing ever, and it will take time for the EMP modders to catch up.

 

The Germans probably will make an epic mod to kickstart EM5 modding, just as they did with the Winterberg mod back in 2006.

 

This is exactly what happened 10 years ago when EM4 modding began. Germans started some things and only by 2006 -2007 did the EM4 LA Mod become as good as it is.

 

I am tired of people wishing "Hoppah will make LA Mod for EM5". No, he said he won't. It would have to be someone else with the time and patience to get into EM5 modding, and most of the pros have no more time to do that.

 

Combined with the fact that EM5 did not live up to the hype and presented itself in a less than desired way, people who know modding well know that EM5 as of right now is not worth the time and effort to build stuff into it.

 

Also, because the game has very limited appeal and only fans of the old games would be interested in it, the pool of talent is quite limited and outsiders who otherwise would have the time and skills for modding the game would be turned off by the overall package of EM5.

[Chris07]

Hoppah and most of the pro modders have said it before that they are too busy these days to make something as big as the LA Mod was at the time. EM5 itself hasn't proven to be the most friendly or easy to use thing ever, and it will take time for the EMP modders to catch up.

 

The Germans probably will make an epic mod to kickstart EM5 modding, just as they did with the Winterberg mod back in 2006.

 

This is exactly what happened 10 years ago when EM4 modding began. Germans started some things and only by 2006 -2007 did the EM4 LA Mod become as good as it is.

 

I am tired of people wishing "Hoppah will make LA Mod for EM5". No, he said he won't. It would have to be someone else with the time and patience to get into EM5 modding, and most of the pros have no more time to do that.

 

Combined with the fact that EM5 did not live up to the hype and presented itself in a less than desired way, people who know modding well know that EM5 as of right now is not worth the time and effort to build stuff into it.

 

Also, because the game has very limited appeal and only fans of the old games would be interested in it, the pool of talent is quite limited and outsiders who otherwise would have the time and skills for modding the game would be turned off by the overall package of EM5.

 

Not to mention that there are quite a few critical mechanisms which were built into EM4 that EM5 doesn't have...enterable buildings being one of the biggest. It would take a lot of time just to bring base EM5 up to the level of functionality that base EM4 had.

[theparanoid]

Hoppah and most of the pro modders have said it before that they are too busy these days to make something as big as the LA Mod was at the time. EM5 itself hasn't proven to be the most friendly or easy to use thing ever, and it will take time for the EMP modders to catch up.

 

The Germans probably will make an epic mod to kickstart EM5 modding, just as they did with the Winterberg mod back in 2006.

 

This is exactly what happened 10 years ago when EM4 modding began. Germans started some things and only by 2006 -2007 did the EM4 LA Mod become as good as it is.

 

I am tired of people wishing "Hoppah will make LA Mod for EM5". No, he said he won't. It would have to be someone else with the time and patience to get into EM5 modding, and most of the pros have no more time to do that.

 

Combined with the fact that EM5 did not live up to the hype and presented itself in a less than desired way, people who know modding well know that EM5 as of right now is not worth the time and effort to build stuff into it.

 

Also, because the game has very limited appeal and only fans of the old games would be interested in it, the pool of talent is quite limited and outsiders who otherwise would have the time and skills for modding the game would be turned off by the overall package of EM5.

Well one of the reason for long delay in em4 was the English version of the game did not come out until a year after the game had been out in Germany. I know this for fact because I got an copy of German version of EM4 when I was in Germany in May of 2006.

[Newfoundking]

Honestly, all the English modding community now is one of three things:

1. A consumer and will Not be producing anything

2. Pissed off with the new game and staying away

3. Not skilled to develop a full mod in thus engine at this time

There may be the outliers who are skilled and willing to but so far indications are otherwise

[itchboy]

Honestly, all the English modding community now is one of three things:

1. A consumer and will Not be producing anything

2. Pissed off with the new game and staying away

3. Not skilled to develop a full mod in thus engine at this time

There may be the outliers who are skilled and willing to but so far indications are otherwise

To expand on this:

• In context to #3: Not skilled enough to develop full mod, which is why they only take content from other mods (*ehem* LA *ehem* Mayberry) and do reskins on the vehicles. This is what has killed EM4 modding.

   

• Its gone full circle. EM4 modding started with reskins, went to bigger mods, peaked with LA mod, ERS Berlin, RTS mod, and now we are back to reskins.

   

• There are a few outliers such as myself, but the only person who burst onto the modding scene like I did is me.

   

• It bothers me that people like #1 and #2 are the ones calling for people to make mods for EM5.

   

[MikeyPI]

 

To expand on this:

• In context to #3: Not skilled enough to develop full mod, which is why they only take content from other mods (*ehem* LA *ehem* Mayberry) and do reskins on the vehicles. This is what has killed EM4 modding.

   

• Its gone full circle. EM4 modding started with reskins, went to bigger mods, peaked with LA mod, ERS Berlin, RTS mod, and now we are back to reskins.

   

• There are a few outliers such as myself, but the only person who burst onto the modding scene like I did is me.

   

• It bothers me that people like #1 and #2 are the ones calling for people to make mods for EM5.

   

 

Most of the #2 category could not care if there are mods developed for EM5, it's mostly 1 or 3 on that score.  Most of those in Cat.2 won't touch the game period, the off handed ones that may would be because the devs change it in a way to make it worth another try.

 

You're not the only one who "burst" onto the modding scene, you're just the only one that has done it since you've been around, many people have sprouted up in the past out of the blue with full-blown mods before.. It used to happen, these days not so much.  People come and go as time goes on, some contribute more than others, but it's a fact of life that over time most are forgotten in lieu of those who still give the candy out.  It's the way of the world that most are not remembered after their time of contributing passes.

 

In the end though with this game having such a limited market I don't see it as highly likely that someone will "burst" onto the scene wanting to learn their way through the minefield that is EM5 to make something special happen there, the game just doesnt have the following to expect many from outside to be lining up to take a shot at it.  It's the reality of a niche market game, and where the developers failed miserably in not trying to make it easier for their current following to pick up their new system. Most don't have the time to invest in an all-new structure to do mostly what they've already done before, so the motivation isnt quite there either for most of the cat. 2 people.

[Hoppah]

Was it ever alive?

 

[C.F.D]

I felt like a mortician when I did the project reality lights for EM5. You know, someone who prepares a corpse with make-up before the funeral ...

[PaganiZonda760]

a perfect example for a game development, working with forum and community is te Unkownworlds team for the game "subnautica". Very good example.

[Tactics]

A shitshow of a game we paid $49 for.

[Vicky Fox]

It was a failure form the start:

First off there was the Emergency 2000s series spin off games which had no modification capabilities which was a BAD mistake!

 

3 to 4 years later Emergency 5 came out which was filled with bugs and glitches as well as the numerous occasions of game crashing, sadly Emergency 4 was more player friendly, easier on the computer and although EM5 had better graphics, it doesn't make up for the losses and is just not worth the time.

 

Also a real bit of disappointment was the fact that the game is centred around Germany which they are showing off their pride possibly a bit too much and looking egocentric and although the game is made for most regions of the world, simple fact is that the culture and some themes just don't apply well.

 

The saddest part of EM5's flop is the probably the fact that the game was worked on and rushed because lots of loyal fans were disappointed with Emergency 2012,13 and 14 and felt that they needed to act quick as they were running late for a deadline too.

 

I wish they showed more international interest other than including Obama in a mission, actually took time in vast range of bugs, glitches and game crashes as well as look up what the difference is between a Patch and DLC.

[MikeyPI]

Em5 was rushed out frankly way before it should have been, poorly optimized and requiring too much power to make it run on machines, for a graphics upgrade only it demands quite a bit of power considering if anything the gameplay was dumbed down.

 

Everyone who's been within the community for a while and played previous entries can admit that the game is and always was tailored to the German community first and foremost, that really is not anything new for this franchise.  Most people have been spoiled by all the mods from various other places and forget that even the moddable games previous to 5 were when they initially came about German games, modders took them from German to various other locales which increased the appeal to a larger niche group.

 

The thing that rubs most people the wrong way with regards to em5 I believe is more or less what was promised to them in comparison to what was delivered.. They promised far more than what was given on release, and even still today, but that aside I think the price-point that they sold this thing at is what really upset most people.  For what was paid for the game people were expecting a proper premium game title to be delivered, instead what was delivered was more or less at best a budget title with very attractive graphics but largely unoptimized and incomplete in many ways.  The end result that was delivered is more comparable to a "project greenlight" early-access game you could find on steam, the difference being the price and the fact most of them are honest about the incomplete nature of the product they're selling.  Seems to me they were expecting the end-user to make the game complete for them, but without documentation it made it to where many modders asked why would I want to step backwards and have to learn all this over again just to maybe break even with what I already have with just better graphics?

 

They never cared about the international market directly in their games before, so it should not come as a shock that they still did not when it came to em5.

 

In the end I think it was more the price point for what was delivered that really got under people's skins, far too often devs will overcharge for something that is simplified but prettier, and requires a monster machine to run it right.. That just makes people feel like they've been taken for a ride and in this case I can't fault them for feeling that way. In regards to the patch vs DLC thing, it's a minor point, but I do agree their "DLC" is more of a patch to put in the things they promised in the first place, so in my book that was more of a patch than a DLC, but in the end the terminology does not really matter in my book unless you're planning to charge for content that is added.